Tuesday 5th January, 20108 months ago
McCall and the never-ending cycle
Stuart McCall once stated he’d rather be a lucky manager than a good one. With dismal recent form threatening to prematurely terminate Bradford City’s promotion chances, a debate is in full swing over which of these two adjectives he is not.
From a largely encouraging first quarter to the season which saw only 6 defeats from 23, a run of just one win, one draw and four defeats has seen cup interest ended and the distance from the play offs increase, with heavy traffic in-between. With each disappointing result, the pressure is growing on McCall. Five of City’s next six games are on the road, January may prove the month which defines the Bantams season and their manager.
It’s hardly new territory for City to be in a position of contemplating a managerial change. In recent times we’ve been here before with Nicky Law and Colin Todd teetering on the edge before the axe finally fell. What’s always curious is the silence in some quarters.
You won’t find the local media – print or radio – mentioning the manager might be under pressure, save for reading out supporters’ texts on air or allowing supporters’ comments underneath articles.
You won’t find public comment from the Board. Speculation continues to rage over one of the joint Chairmen wanting to issue Stuart his p45 and the other disagreeing; from neither has there been public support for the manager, either.
Yet amongst supporters, there’s barely any other topic of conversation.
Just like with Law and Todd, there’s a split of opinion and a disunity amongst City’s fanbase which will only be repaired by an upturn of results or the pull of the trigger. Typically those who want to see a change are shouting the loudest, on the message boards and, increasingly, at games. Short of risking getting into an ugly fight by registering disagreement, it’s more difficult for those who still support McCall to make their views known as loudly. It makes estimations over percentages for and against his continuing employment near-impossible to make.
The arguments for a change of manager largely focus on the lack of progress McCall has delivered since taking charge two and a half years ago. Admitting he’d consider himself a failure if he didn’t deliver instant promotion before a ball had even been kicked in June 2007, the season after that first failed promotion attempt he vowed to quit if a play off spot wasn’t achieved. It wasn’t, but after many supporters begged him to stay he remained anyway.
To some fans, this is now looked back on as him breaking his own promises and almost considered an act of selfishness. The supporters who had persuaded him to stay, be it through writing to him or holding up an SOS sign during the home game with Rotherham last April, have been regularly attacked online too.
But if most fans forgave the failings of his first two seasons, that this year progress on the field has been limited is causing some to lose faith in McCall’s ability. While the last six results have been disappointing, the frustration was growing in the preceding weeks as City’s 10 game unbeaten run of early autumn gave way to a succession of draws.
The improved home form of last season has disappeared and City are winless at Valley Parade since October 24. Even on the road since impressively beating Shrewsbury in early September, the only two victories have come at the division’s bottom two clubs.
The stats simply do not look good.
Yet coherent calls and sensible arguments for managerial change have largely been lost in a sea of over-the-top criticism which has got nasty, ugly and personal. Many have chosen to go beyond reasonableness in the arguments put forward, in doing so exposing a blinkered view that everything will be okay once McCall has been sacked.
It’s a style and tone of criticism striking similar to what Law and Todd endured. For both it was unfair and wrong, for a City playing legend to be targeted so loathsomely is disgusting and undermines the credibility of the protagonists.
The stats simply do not look good – so why the need to embellish them by expressing half-truths, cooking up improbable analysis, uttering spiteful comments and offering no balance?
In recent weeks results have been influenced by some atrocious refereeing decisions, the squad has been disrupted by injuries and suspensions, while some players have shown poor application over a full 90 minutes – yet rather than acknowledge any lack of fortune, these contributory factors are dismissed as McCall “excuses”. Some fans are more sensible in their reasons for wanting change, but the anger of others is threatening to drown them and everybody else out.
Clearly, there remains a proportion of City supporters who believe in sticking by McCall. While no one could qualify his reign as successful so far, there are nevertheless signs that under Stuart the club is being rebuilt in the right way. Off the field much has improved in recent years and much of this – for example youth set up – can be attributed to the rookie manager, who clearly doesn’t view managing City as just managing any old club.
On the pitch, perhaps belatedly, the balance is finally there. From lack of knowledge of the division undermining McCall’s first season – despite successfully turning round a difficult start – through to bringing in players too good for this level but with not enough heart, it finally seems that McCall is setting out to do what he first promised at the time he declared he’d consider himself a failure if City weren’t promoted at the first attempt. That is to bring in players who would have long term careers at the club, rather than be here for one/two years and then be replaced by another short term player.
Are Gareth Evans, James Hanson, Scott Neilson, Steve Williams, Jonathan Bateson, James O’Brien and Luke O’Brien the finished article which we should get rid of in May? For me they are players of great potential who I look forward to seeing the majority of developing at Valley Parade over subsequent weeks, months and years, with other new additions to add to the squad along the way.
This is the path Stuart has now gone down, but it is not a path of instant success. Julian Rhodes recently stated he considered this year’s squad to be better than last year, but he won’t find many regular City watchers who’d agree. However, in time, he might be proven right. Apart from the defeat to Lincoln in August, City’s defeats have all been to teams who it can be reasonably argued have better squads. Last season’s squad was careless in how often it lost winnable games, this one is short of experience but not effort.
The irony of McCall’s reign at City is the longer-term strategy has started up so late, meaning the patience to be allowed to carry it out has worn thin in many fans’ eyes. But it doesn’t make abandoning it the right thing to do. Of course the idea of being stuck in this division another year or worse is one to cause dismay, but change means starting all over again and hoping the rate of progression is then faster. Hoping being the key word.
For as often as we read or hear fans urging the board to sack McCall, ideas about what should happen next are in short supply. Appeals for an answer to the valid question of how sacking a manager improves the club fall on deaf ears.
There’s seems to be a belief that sacking McCall will make all the difficulties which influence the club disappear, that it will instantly herald the long-awaited upturn.
It is a belief that the success and failure of a football is entirely down to the man in the dug out. It is a belief that a manager who succeeded elsewhere will guarantee the same results in a completely different environment – remember that last season a number of fans wanted Dave Penny to replace McCall, he’s hardly pulling up trees at Oldham. It is a belief that placing faith in leaping into the unknown will eventually be rewarded if you keep trying it.
And it is these beliefs which stop me, and others, from supporting the idea of dismissing McCall. As Michael eloquently put it a few years ago when Todd was under similarly fierce pressure, hand me the ‘McCall out’ banner as I want to believe his removal would send the club soaring back up the leagues. You, me, Mark, Julian and everyone else is sick of City failing and hurt by the recent results, so if Stuart leaving guarantees the pain will be over – let’s do it.
The problem is that his removal guarantees nothing. It just seems like the only thing which can be done. It is the only immediate and obvious remedy.
But what’s the subsequent tactics? Sit back and wait for a pile of managerial CVs to fly through the letter box, pick the best interviewee and hope they can bring instant success? What happens if they don’t, go through the whole CV-picking process again?
It is through this strategy that the club’s success and failure becomes utterly dependent on the manager. It is through this strategy that a revolving door will be needed for all the players coming and going. It is through this strategy that the structure of the club will ultimately suffer because no one is around long enough to give a damn.
Which is not to say City should stick with McCall come what may, but to at least ensure there is that much-fabled ‘Plan B’ in place. In the 90s City adopted a strategy of recruiting internally and grooming the next person, which worked fantastically with Chris Kamara and Paul Jewell before being abandoned after 12 Chris Hutchings games. It provided continuity during a period of rapid change, it ensured that the club was always bigger than any manager.
Maybe right now, an internal replacement for McCall isn’t ready, but maybe right now the change isn’t needed. Maybe just as history shows clubs such as Liverpool, Man United and Nottingham Forest moved upwards because of periods of building under the long term influence of sticking by a manager, City can one day enjoy relative success by allowing McCall time to do the same.
I still believe that he should get to stay in charge until at least the end of the season, I’d ideally like it if he was able to at least finish his two-year contract. For that to happen progress must be made and recent results increase the urgency for improvement.
If the overwhelming feeling is a change must be made, I and others will have to accept it. But if change is only made because a few loudmouths got more say than others as usual, it’s not a well-rounded decision and it becomes an even riskier gamble. For those who didn’t want to come to such a decision, the strong relationship many of us have with City will be weakened because of the usual suspects getting their way, yet again.
Because whether McCall is a bad or unlucky manager, we can all be sure who’ll be the first people calling for the head of his replacement.
I don’t think somebody who expresses a desire for McCall to leave his post by what ever means is necessarily a loud mouth. I think the guy is a true legend but have now had enough. I am not a loudmouth, I just have an opinion that Stuart is not a good manager.
Whilst this article does indeed show that replacing Stuart is not guaranteed to solve City’s problems, it fails in equal measure to illuminate other shortcomings.
The football is poor by any standard, without steel, without drive and without an obvious plan. We are too easy to beat and too easy to roll over when things go against us. We have a manager who refers to players by their nicknames, not their names as a headmaster would rather than a mate in the playground. We don’t look the part, their is no sign of discipline, these are all things I thought Stuart might in still in the team.
Today we read in the T and A he wants everybody and anybody who wants a moan or groan to clear off. Players? Fans? Directors? Who?
Most weeks it’s the ref’s fault or the players who get sent off or our injury list and now the fans. I wonder how much is his fault? When a manager turns on the fans the the end is nigh.
Your support is admirable and Stuart McCall is a true Bradford City legend but come on guys enoughs enough, if he was anybody else he would have been sacked. Sacking a manager doesnt necessarily mean an up turn in fortunes. Tell that to Leeds and Norwich. Lets concentrate on facts, hard facts the results of our club on the pitch are dismal 3 home wins from 14 attempts in the bottom division. Simply woeful on the pitch and desperately disappointing off it.
Paul, with respect your criticism of Stuart for referring to players by their nicknames is typical of the improable analysis I mentioned. Is there any proof that calling someone by their nickname makes them underperform or not try? In my job, my manager calls me by my nickname. Heck some of the company directors do on occasions. It doesn’t make any difference to how I perform or how much effort I put in. I fail to understand how Stuart’s style of using nicknames can be used as a reason for him apparently not being a good manager. Let’s also remember that Stuart was a player for some 20 years. Did managers use a nickname when talking to him? Did that in anyway affect how well he played or how hard he tried? If so, would he now call others by their nicknames? I seem to remember Paul Jewell publicly referred to players by their nicknames – did he do a bad job at City?
Stuart defends his players in public like any good manager – I just think this is misinterpreted by some as a willingness to try to be matey with his players. If we knew what went on in the confides of the dressing room we would have a better opinion. but we don’t, so there is no way of knowing what impact using nicknames has or how he treats his players.
You say “let’s concentrate on the hard facts”, but then bring this subjective opinion up as a reason to sack him. Also just referring to 3 wins from 14 attempts at home is singling out one fact rather than trying to cover the full picture.
Another “hard fact” is that City are six points off the play offs with 23 games to go.
He’s had a go back at the doubters and the moaners to keep quiet or go elsewhere – that was aimed at everyone connected with the club – presumably players, supporters, staff and maybe Directors ?!
The problem he has is that just 3 wins at VP in the league this season is appalling – bottom 6 stats if you want.
It does not take much for some vocal moaners to kick off in the best of seasons, but there seems to be a growing number of supporters who are questioning the progress made in McCall’s managerial reign – most of them depserate to have seen him suceed – there is no visible sign of vocal discontent – that is a sign of the high respect afforded to McCall – he would do well to bear that in mind before launching any more offensives himself through the press as these situations escalate if results do not improve.
Very well written article.
Couldn’t have put things better.
If you look at some of the message boards, the criticism with no foundation is unbelievable. Any reason for a defeat is an ‘excuse’. Any chance missed is ‘bad coaching’. Any goal conceded is ‘how is that possible with 2 defenders as coaches’. Everything is twisted to suit their opinion.
I may be a glass half full sort of person but, all I want success for Bradford City and I believe that sacking McCall wouldn’t give us this. I have no agenda, I don’t want to be ‘proved right’, I just SUPPORT my team.
I personally am not sure about Stuart, but I am certain that no one would be guaranteed to succeed with the resources at his disposal. Brian Laws and Brian Little prove that football management is to a very great extent a matter of luck. The photos of Williams’foul on Saturday, showing it was outside the area, prove this. No penalty, no sending-off , possibly 3 points.
I hope the chairmen give Stuart to the end of NEXT season at least, and concentrate their efforts on keeping crowds up, and solving the Gibb problem.
The only thing McCall has done wrong in recent weeks is not teach the players how to dive and cheat their way to 3 points.
Anyhow, I want someone to suggest a possible new manager that:
a) Is experienced enough for the job (a criticism against McCall from many);
b) Knows how to work on a shoestring budget;
c) Is affordable after the cost of paying off McCall;
d) Is NOT Peter Jackson or Stan Ternent;
e) Would be, above all, interested in taking over.
I find it incredibly difficult to think of possible candidates. Alan Knill from Bury? Jim Gannon as a long shot?
Let’s hope the board have someone lined up if they do decide to sack McCall. No-one in their right mind wants a repeat of the Colin Todd fiasco and the problems that followed
It’s a really tricky one. I think Jason’s article sums up the difficulty. I am veering towards Paul’s view though. McCall is a City God and he will be hurting more than anyone. Well I say more than anyone, but of course he won’t be hurting as much as Lawn & Rhodes who are putting their time and money in and seeing poor performances in week after week.
If Stuart wasn’t a City god he would have gone by now and I suspect this is the quandary Lawn/Rhodes find themselves in. What is clear however is that they must have someone lined up to replace him.
What worries me is the fact that we are blaming the refs (even my dad above is!). What those photos show was that Williams pulled the bloke back and it was a matter of inches as to being outside the area. He would have been through and so for me the sending off is fair enough – in fact straight red for me. As for a dive he did right to go down – his chance and angle had gone. The only game Ive been to is the Shrewsbury game and for me the ref got one decision in the match wrong – true the second yellow was crucial, but he did very little wrong. True we’re not getting the rub of the green but to call refs cheats is ridiculous.
I just hope Stuart can turn it round but for me the facts are that we are now as bad as any time in the past 35 (?) years and showing no signs of improvement.
Yes, I too have had my doubts on Stuart’s ability, the way this season is going, but I can’t see where sacking him would leave us, particularly when none of those clamouring for a sacking seem to have any reasonable suggestions – let’s face it; we’d need available/cheap (ie out of a job) but experienced / good – for his replacement. It seems the view is “nothing could be worse than keeping him in charge”, and we’ve been there before. This was what the sacking of Colin Todd looked like, and look where that left us.
I was never a fan of Todd, but thought he had the nous to keep us in the First Division in his last season. Instead he was sacked (to appease people?) and we were left with a rookie Weatherall who(regardless of what you thought of him as a player then or as a coach now) was clearly out of his depth when it came to the fight to come. So we were relegated to a division we’re finding it difficult to get out of.
A very well written article Jason.
Being a Level 2 Football Coach, I tend to see more of what we aren’t doing as opposed to what we are doing well. However thats not to say I agree with those calling for Stuarts head quite the opposite, my main questions I pose to these people who are, are as follows:
1. Who would you bring in to replace him?
2. What do you think said manager is going to be able to do with what would be a shoestring budget, considering the likelihood the backroom staff will go and some of the playing staff?
3. And finally in 18 months times once this manager has had limited success due to the factors outlined above will you be calling for his head?
I can already answer question 3 for you. As John says I would hope Stuart is here until at least the end of next season because one thing I didn’t see you mentioning in the article Jason is that the club has progressed if only marginally, this year has seen a team which is willing to fight for a game more than the teams in the previous 2 years, that is progress in my mind.
To the first person to comment I suppose you do not consider the last 2 sendings off to be harsh or game changing? Well consider that against Shrewsbury they had not had a notable effort on goal before the sending off so we were then forced to sacrifice attacking guile for defensive options. Against Cheltenham we once again had to sacrifice attacking option to bring on an inexperienced player however it is my view that we looked the most threatening.
There is still a lot of football left to play, and only 6 points to recover give McCall the time and I am sure that gap will be bridged. We have not been outplayed by any side at VP bear the exception of Rochdale and on many occasions the result has been rather misleading as to the game itself.
Rome was not Built in a day, nor was it built in 3 years, neither can a football club. However a change of manager now would bring down all the good work that has already been done and the likelihood is we could slip out of the League and then we would lose Valley Parade as well, because no conference team no matter how good the support can maintain the rent we do.
I’ve resisted airing my views for a while, but can do so no longer. Whilst I understand that there are those who have some valid reasons for their unwavering support of Stuart, I dislike what I perceive (perhaps wrongly) to be a “holier than thou” attitude towards people who don’t think Stuart is up to the job.
However, I agree that there are plenty of idiots who post mindless, puerile and insensitive rubbish on message-boards. For those of us who believe it is time for Stuart to go, these postings are actually unhelpful, because they tar us so-called “anti-McCall types” with the same idiotic brush.
I think that the reason some of the postings are so vitriolic is, in a perverse sense, due to the immense respect that Stuart commands. Very few people would openly (i.e. at Valley Parade) criticise a man who has been so committed to Bradford City, but the frustration at our predicament still exists among many supporters, so rather than the chanting at the ground, the frustration spills over on the message boards.
I am in the ‘McCall Out’ camp. Taking aside any other issues, he has tried three different approaches in his three seasons. He has failed with an inherited side, failed with a side of proven players, and whilst I sincerely hope otherwise, is showing strong signs of failing again. I take Jason’s point that sacking a manager does not guarantee an upturn in fortunes, but quite frankly I believe that few managers could have done worse in Stuart’s two and a half years, and signs of improvement are limited.
One of the major plus points of the last few months has been the acquisition of the young talent, for which Stuart should be given credit. If I believed that Stuart had the ability to mould these players into a successful team, then I would advocate him staying. Sadly I don’t. I found his open criticism of youngsters Williams and O’Brien following Saturday’s game quite embarassing, given his reticence to openly criticise his senior players, many of whom are far more responsible for our predicament than those learning their trade.
As Paul noted, Stuart’s comments regarding moaning supporters are the final straw for me. The man will forever be a playing legend at the club, but ultimately those moaners pay his wages and I fear that his comments may be the factor that turns the message-board criticism into revolt on the terraces. That really would be a sad way to end and I wish there was an alternative…but I can’t see one.
Hi David
While I don’t agree with your view, I’m pleased you’ve aired it. To me this is what I would call a sensible anti-McCall comment and I’m glad you achnowledge that others are going too far. No one should have a holier than thou attitude towards people they don’t agree with, but if some fans can only resort to mindless abuse towards Stuart why do they deserve to be listened? It is that type of criticism I can’t stand.
Thanks Jason.
Whilst I do not enjoy our current predicament, one of the joys of being a football supporter is sharing views and having sensible discussions with those who have differing opinions, as you, I, and many others do in this instance. In fact it would incredibly boring if we all thought alike.
Unfortunately mindless abuse is a societal problem that we won’t change, but that’s another subject for another day on another website!
I am with Paul on the nickname matter. It all smacks of matey matey to me when a manger refers to their players by their nicknames a la McLaren and his Stevie G and JT and Lamps. There needs to be respect between players and managers. Can you imagine Capello calling his players by their nicknames.
The same goes for the shorts and boots outfit Stuart goes for. He isn’t one of the players so stop looking like one.
Minor irrelevant points but ones I wanted to make.
As it happens, I still think we should stick with Stuart at least until the end of the season. Whilst I think he lacks any tactical nous and is in desparate need of some experience alongside him, simply changing the manager all the time clearly does not work so let’s stick with him, see how it goes and make a judgement at the end of nthe season
I’m sorry Robert but for starters how can you possibly make an inciteful comment on the current events at City if you’ve only been to the Shrewsbury game this season?
I agree with Jason, the stats do speak volumes but they only say so much, you take the *cough* Leeds *cough* Man U game at the weekend, in terms of attempts Man U had 13 to Leeds’ 6, they had 8 corners to Leeds’ 3 but the stat that mattered is that Leeds had 1 in the goal column whilst Man U didn’t. It’s a similar story for the Cheltenham game on Saturday, the BBC sports website went with the caption: ‘Ten-man Bradford City hold on to take a draw against Cheltenham to halt their run of three consecutive home defeats’, the stats suggest a tight game fought out by two closely matched sides (shots: 5 vs 4, possession: 52 vs 48, corners: 6 vs 5) only the attempts column I feel truly reflects the game (city 7 vs cheltenham 4. By being at the game on Saturday I would say that we weren’t holding on at any point, and if a bit more composure had been used at times (namely Flynn firing across the face instead of squaring the ball) we could have ended up with the points. Admittedly we have been on the negative end of a lot of close reults this season, which Stuart duly points out, if half of these would’ve gone City’s way (cf. Northampton away, Accrington home, Morecambe away etc) then we’d comfortably be sitting in an automatic promotion spot, would many fans still be moaning then?
Although this appears to make me sound like Stuart’s number one fan, I’m not. I think that tactically we have one approach, especially if James Hanson is playing, and when we do play the long ball others such as Evans, Flynn, Neilson rarely gamble on Hanson winning the ball, which he does 90% of the time. I also think that he doesn’t pick the right team for the conditions: a heavy, sodden and basically knackered pitch doesn’t suit having two wingers in the side (a la Shrewbury). And when playing wingers in the side you need to get them into the game whicg is difficult punting the ball to Hanson, especially when the pitch is huge (a la Darlinton away). In these areas Stuart has downfalls, ones that need to be continually addressed. In my career as a teacher if my knowledge is a bit shakey on one particularly thing I make sure I go out there research and learn it and this is undoubtebly what McCall must be doing. No one is ever fully the finished article, there is always room to improve.
Overall I have to side with Jason. McCall should have at least until the end of the season, we should allow the team and the manager the opportunity to progress. We also need to improve in the areas we have short falls, ie building upon early dominance, if we could turn one nil into two at half-time at VP then we could have a very different second half of the season. As always it is a big ‘if’. I know I will be still be there supporting the team through thin and thinner and with some loyalty and encouragement from the supporters we will hopefully finish this year on a high.
McCall missed out on the play-offs last season by 3 points, he couldn’t keep Law, Furman, and Jones, not because he is a poor Manager, but because of a shortage of money -nowt new there then! As stated above, we are only 6 points from a play-off place with half the season left to play and with young players that will keep improving -with supporter encouragement. If people want to blame Stuart for his players committing fouls resulting in Penalties and/or sendings off and costing us the points that would have probably put us in a play-off spot fine, but thats how close it is! And if that’s the case I think it wont be long before he gets blamed for a player being late for training because he didn’t take the winter weather conditions into consideration.
We have more chance of getting promoted than relegated with McCall and the Team he has put together with the money he has to work with. He is laying the foundations -finally- let him get on with it.
Lawrence – Firstly, I have only been to 1 game because I live in Salisbury and have 3 kids under 11 so plenty of weekend commitments. I will be at Aldershot away rearranged and Bournemouth away (which I hope is better than last year). Secondly, I am able to comment on the major decisions because of BBC and Sky highlights. Thirdly, my comments were not meant to incite anything. Fourthly, I can comment on the ref at Shrewsbury because I was there and on the WIlliams’ sending off because of Michael’s photos.
I think we are all in the same boat on here, we all want City success and we would all love Stuart to be the man who delivers it – some of us have given up hope, some of us don’t which way to think (eg me, who doesn’t get to games!) and some of us keep the faith.
Robert, I’m not criticising the fact that you can’t get to games, I’m only making the point that the BBC/Sky coverage rarely gives you the full picture of what actually happened. As to judging the decision to give Williams a straight red card: “He would have been through and so for me the sending off is fair enough – in fact straight red for me”, as the pictures show Williams definitely tugs the shirt, but clearly outside the box (and therefore a free-kick), the ref had every right to issue a second booking, but there were other city defenders in line with Williams so he wouldn’t have been the last defender.
Next, the ref at the Shrewsbury game was appaulingly inconsitent which is where the problem lies, decisions he punished City for went unpunished at a later stage in the game for Shrewsbury. The referee exhibited a total lack of control which resulted in the fans getting on his back, to appease these fans he made more inconsistent decisions, namely the booking for the Shrews player near the corner flag towards the end of the game. I can take bad officiating if it atleast consistently bad and fair for both sides, the assessor will see it and hopefully do something about it (probably promote them to the premier league! Probert…what a joke!).
I realise this thread is discussing Stuart but had to get that off my chest. I agree with John, the little margins have gone against us, with the bit of luck that we’re due we could fly up this league, three or four wins on the bounce and we’d be right back up there. So let’s get behind the team and see where we are come the end of the season.
Ref Law, Furman and Jones – they were all loan players – not ours as such and therefore able to pick from the offers reveived – 2 opted for league 1 football which you can’t argue with and the other (Law) went for a club nearer his home and family, plus no doubt a heavier pay packet – again you can’t say that was selfish.
Loans this seasons, namely Eastwood have been a bone of contention until his departure back to Huddersfield as a more experienced keeper – leaving us short and having to field a rookie who may as well have been developed by us than another from outside – who has benefited more from the Eastwood deal? – not City, bar the Paint Cup heroics.
This aspect of management by McCall made me question his long term prospects of success more than anything else.
I love a good debate.
And having read all the comments on this can understand why passions on either side are boiling over and becoming subjective.
I like the comment on who could be a better man for the job at this present time, also who would want to be the better man and take the hot seat if the board were to pull the trigger.
Myself I like to be subjective and would like to pose a question, despite the result how many times have you come away from the game thinking we should have had all 3 points or we should have got something there or we were well and truly beaten and deserved nothing. in all 3 I would like you to mark one notch and tally them up that should show you how well we are doing (apart from the points tally in the league table)
What it seems to come down to is if you would prefer to win ugly than see a good game of football and many supporters want to see an ugly win.
Where do I stand on the matter, well Fergie is still at Man utd having been one game from the sack and he’s done okay there. Mark Hughes is out of work and has the experience :). I’d wait until the end of the season, and then no reason to make a decision come sorrow or joy.
I dont get to many games as I play footy on a Saturday and live down south. This doesnt make me any less a supporter. The amount of stick I got runnign around in my Bradford shirt and footy training it would be pointless to do anything different. From the games I have seen this season, the permanent squad is far better than last year. What we are missing is Lee and a solid goalie.
This is where my gripe comes in. What I see coming out of the message boards etc is a bandwagon effect. There is no independant thought. As soon as someone become a hate figure thats it. It was only until Daley got injured did people realise how good he was. It was only until a few months into this season did we realise how good a defender Lee was.
Yes I am depressed by this season but I see progress in the squad. The one thing which I keep reminding myself off is look at the likes of Darlington, Hereford, Stockport etc. Sides full opf expensive players cannot be maintained, sides full of loan players cannot be maintained, sides full of players on their way down cannot be maintained. Football is a results business but with a bit of luck and one of two key signings, we can easily make these play offs. We just need to be patient, and to me that menas keeping Stuart on. Warnock rated him and as much as I hate the guy he knows a lot more about managemnt than us guys!! (PS I do agree with many comments that the McCall out brigade say on here but I cannot see how a change of manager this season would benefit anyone, epsecially with no money to spend!!)
I’m sorry Jason I just don’t agree with you. We have won 3 home games all season and whether we are 6 points from the play off’s or not the team is without a backbone. Can you see anything to suggest we will hit 40 odd points in the second half of the season? (Based on our current home form and inability to defend a lead away from home)
I cited the nickname issue as an example of something I think represents a lack of discipline within the club. It is ludicrous to suggest I or anyone else would sack him for this reason alone. As someone else mentioned, who agreed with my point of view, his demeanour in the dug out is also poor.He looks scruffy. You might not put a lot of emphasis on these things, they certainly are less important if the team is winning but I think they represent the general picture with the first team at the moment.
We could go round in circles all day but the whole thing is a jigsaw and all the pieces have to fit. Passion, tactical awareness, love for the club, love of winning, sportsmanship, professionalism, ability to mix it up and win nasty if needs be.I could go on and on. Some of these things are missing, some are there.
A lot of people are defending Stuart and that is fine by me but very few are telling us at what point they think the line should be drawn. Do we wait till we are relegated? If we stay up does Stuart get another year to try again with his young squad.
John Watmough has been on the OMB defending Stuart as well, maybe some of you chaps in the journalistic world could actually balance up your arguments and discuss when it’s time to draw the line. It seems at the moment we are being judged as over reacting. Keep up the good work because I enjoy most articles and as always CTID
Paul – with respect me and you aren’t going to agree on this issue.
Can I see us hit 40 points this season? Probably not. But the question is not can we get promoted this season but whether Stuart should remain as manager. This is a different issue and while I will be as gutted as the next City fan if we don’t get promoted this season, I don’t want it to be the margin which decides the future of our club.
In my opinion, the last two seasons were all about promotion or bust. Both times we failed and it hurt. I, and others, want to see this club built up on firmer foundations, with an eye on years not months. I want to end this season at the every least with the potential to really go for it next season, because we will have spent time grooming players, accepting their mistakes and allowing them to develop while bringing in some additions. We don’t know what’s in store for the next few months – but one thing we can guarantee is there won’t be sizeable transfer funds in the summer. Whether it is Stuart or a new manager starting from scratch, the transfer funds will be limited. Unlike the summer before last, we won’t be signing up five or six players from the division above, offering them wages we can’t fully afford and gambling on them taking us up. For me we have to be more long-term, develop the players we pick up cheaply. A new manager coming in for next season will struggle to make an instant promotion-winning team, just as Stuart has.
In short – sack Stuart now and we start again. Keep him and the path we have started and the progress we have made can continue.
Frankly it doesn’t matter if McCall called every player sir and dressed in a tuxedo at every match – a section of our supporters would find another reason to criticise him that goes beyond rationale. Nicknames and shorts in winter have nothing to do with how good a manager McCall is, and until someone convicingly explains how such ‘crimes’ have a determimental affect I find it difficult to respect the views of people trying to credibly argue they do. Sorry, but there’s no evidence to suggest calling someone by a nickname represents a lack of discipline. Other managers do it.
What is the line? I don’t know, but in my view it has not been reached. We are in a poor run of form, that’s all. We are not in danger of relegation. We have largely played well this season and deserved more points than we’ve got. That is often our own fault, mistakes by the players etc. This can be improved over the season.
Finally as I mentioned before people who want McCall to go have every right to express that view. The stats don’t look good. What I and others find frustrating is the over the top manner it is expressed, and frankly going on about nicknames is a prime example of this. I appreciate you want McCall gone even if I don’t agree, I just don’t personally like the abuse directed at someone who – no matter his ability – is clearly trying his best.
How good it is to see such sensible and reasoned argument( unlike the T and A message-board). I have spoken very severely to my 41 year-old son for his misstating of my views, and particularly for a grammatical error which he made. Modern education!!
As you know, due to age, I do not get to many games, but you cannot stop supporting. My dad saw City win promotion in 1929, and used to wax lyrical about Dickie Bond. I do the same about John McCole. You will talk to your kids about Stuart McCall.
Best wishes.
My concern is that it’s never as simple a sjust replacing a manager. In my opinion Stuart has performed excellently in attracting players of the right ability and at the right price over ther last 3 seasons. Now following a lower budget strategy and hoping to bring young players through form lower leagues he has assembled the makings of a more than decent squad.
If Stuart is sacked and someone else takes over we lose everything he has worked for. Part of the team will change in January and then in the summer (assuming the ‘lucky’ new manager is still in place) the entire squad will change. This is what happens these days in thie league. But, is it what we really want? I for one vote no and hope Stuart is in charge until at least the end of next season.
I think the last paragraph says a lot; “Because whether McCall is a bad or unlucky manager”
This is a results driven game and the results add up to ‘nowt.
I do not agree with sacking Stuart but the team must start looking for a long term strategy.
Director of Football anyone?
I also don’t think we will agree. It always amuses me how a word such as “crimes” can be thrown into a debate as if somebody had actually used it. You have used that, I certainly didn’t. Like I have said more than once, I used the nickname scenario as an example of something I don’t like. It smacks of ill discipline something which we suffer from and with us finishing the last three home games with ten men who could argue.Clearly you, however it is certainly not a reason for his dismissal, so please stop saying I have said it is.
It seems to me that you don’t want to change manager for continuity’s sake rather than because you think Stuart is a good manager. Do you think Stuart is a good manager and if so why?
re: nicknames, when you say “it is something I don’t like”. I think that sums it up. The use of nicknames is always a subjective thing. Some people like to talk to people using them, others hate them. Some people call me Jason, some Jay, some Jase. I don’t mind, but that’s my personality. Stuart’s personality, just like many other managers, is to use nicknames. It doesn’t really have any bearing on his ability as a manager and I fail to see how it does.
Were the three sendings off a result of ill-discipline, somehow connected to the use of nicknames, or is it in anyway connected to poor refereeing decisions? Was Matt Clarke sent off because McCall calls him “Clarkey” and he thinks he can do what he likes, or did two Shrewsbury players con the ref? Why was Dean Windass sent off so many times for City?
I don’t believe in continuity for the sake of it, I believe that Stuart is building a squad which will continue to improve and I want him to be given the time to do that. Do I think Stuart is a good manager? That’s not a simple yes or no question to me. I like what he is trying to achieve, when we play well I like the style of football we produce. I like the way he coaches players and works with them to improve, getting them to learn from mistakes rather than dropping them and looking for the quick win of bringing in a replacement. I like how much he cares for this club and how hard he tries. I like the fact he has more steel about it and isn’t allowing criticism to affect him like he has in the past. I like the way he has tried to build up the club on and off the pitch. I hope in time all of these things means we can one day sit back and agree he is a good manager. Perhaps right now I can’t simply answer yes, but I also can’t say no.
I’ve heard various people refer to Stuart as an ‘unlucky’ manager and I would have to agree that in respect of injuries and key refereeing decisions he had an unrelenting pattern of terrible luck in 2009. Give Bournemouth or Dagenham (for example) even half our injuries in that time and they would not be flying so high, yet Howe and Still seem to have had a virtually bulletproof first 11 which has protected their tiny squads.
What I’ve found immediately frustrating about watching this team is its inconsistency, but then I remember that it is a team of first-year professionals, young hopefuls and the odd slightly older figure (when they aren’t injured), and in reality young players and teams are always inconsistent but become less so as they mature. The inability of a young team to hold a lead away from home or to turn a knife-edge draw into three points is common throughout football. This team that has lost four in six also went ten unbeaten a short while ago, and the team that lost deservedly at home to Rochdale also won deservedly at Rochdale. Stuart has signed most of these players, and he should be judged on their progress over a period that is sufficient for a proper assessment to be made and that, in my opinion, is at least until the end of this season, or perhaps until his luck finally evens out.
I think it’s madness to sack a manager, any manager, with half the season left to play, especially when their team is only six points off the play-off places.
That Stuart McCall is an unlucky manager, there is no doubt. Omar Daley, Peter Thorne and Stephen O’Leary have spent long periods injured. The recent rush of bizarre and plainly incorrect refereeing decisions have surely cost us points. I don’t see these facts as excuses because they are outwith the manager’s control.
I do believe that the squad, though thin, is stronger than it was last year, especially when loan signings are taken out of the equation. Is there anyone here that would swap Simon Ramsden for Paul Arnison, Michael Flynn for Paul McLaren or Gareth Evans for Barry Conlon (bless ‘im)? The one player that we really miss from last year is Rhys Evans.
Of course, Stuart McCall is not exempt from criticism but let’s criticise him for things that are within his control. The team still has no natural (that is, left footed) left winger. The team has lacked width all year and Luke O’Brien is seemingly expected to do the work of two men on the left wing. The willingness of James Hanson and Gareth Evans to provide some width is admirable but too often they are both pulled wide at the same time and there is no striker left in the box should a cross come in.
It’s great that we now have a tall centre forward in James Hanson but too often the ball just lumped in his general direction by one of the centre backs. I’d rather see him trying to get on the end of crosses from wide than playing with his back to goal most of the time.
I believe that Stuart should be given until the end of the season, at least. Omar Daley’s return to fitness will give the team some of the width and counter-attacking pace that it has lacked for a year now. I believe that the team is better than recent results would suggest and that a play off place is still perfectly achievable.
Well done Jason for another thought-provoking article which is proven by the number of comments you’ve received from readers.
Despite our current poor run of results, I hope that Stuart McCall is still our manager at the beginning of next season. Listening to his post-match comments on Radio Leeds, I feel that he usually gives an honest assessment of our games.
Jason mentions instant success somewhere in his article and for me too many football supporters, not just Bradford City, want success instantly and don’t look at the bigger picture or a long term strategy. It was only at the home game against Rotherham in April 2009 that over 10,000 people inside Valley Parade were desparate for McCall to stay with us. More recently, we had a 10 game unbeaten run and many supporters were saying how good Stuart had done in the transfer market with the signings of Ramsden, Williams, James O’Brien, Gareth Evans and James Hanson. Fast forward to January 2010 and people are calling for McCall to be sacked.
I’m not saying that McCall has got everything right, as our current form suggests, be he’s a manager that’s still learning. I get frustrated with some of his substitutions or the lack of them at times and I get a bit dis-heartened with our style of play at times. However, I believe that Stuart will get us promoted to Division 3 if given the time.
Having missed only one home league game this season and having attended four away games, I feel that I’m in a position to offer comment on our performances this season. For what it’s worth, I believe that we’ve received some harsh refereeing decisions which have ultimately cost us points. But as they say, these things even themselves out over a season.
I said it before a ball had been kicked this season and I’m still of the same opinion now, that we won’t finish in a top 7 position this season. This doesn’t mean that I want our manager to change now. I suppose it’s about expectations.
For those who want a change in manager, you won’t find another manager more committed to Bradford City Football Club and how much will it cost the club to pay Stuart off? And when that’s happened how much money is available to pay a new manager and make money available for the new players that they will want?
I think the article written by Jason is one of the most balanced I have seen on the issue of SM. I don’t believe that SM is the finished article yet as I also don’t believe that this team is either. I have watched almost every home game and a few away games since SM started and I believe that the team we have now is the most exciting of the last three seasons. They are no more skilled than the team that SM inherited in his first season but he has instilled in them more desire to win games and you can see them fighting to the end of every game. They are less experienced overall than the team “bought in” in SM’s second season but they are much more enjoyable to watch and are the type of team needed for this league with the desire to get stuck in and fight for every ball.
The only way we are going to see if this team is good enough to get out of this league is to give them two seasons under SM (four came from non-league remember). I am not a proponent of keeping SM at all costs and if we are still in league 2 at the end of his contract then the contract should not be renewed and someone else should be appointed. If there is a change of manager before the end of his contract then not only will it cost the club in compensation (which will afect the amount we can pay a new manager) but he will not be able to see through his development of youth players (Sharry and Horne for example, the latter of which I thought looked extremely composed for a youngster against Cheltenham in a difficult situation).
Ultimately then rather than simply calling for a change of manager we should get behind him whilst he is in contract because even though we are all passionate about football at the end of the day a football club is a business and if sound business decisions are made now for good financial reasons then this will assist with the long term stability of the club.